Black immigrants are closing the white-black achievement gap

LB

Peace Love n Pretty Tings
You need to learn a bit about the dynamics between West Indians and African Americans when we FIRST reach here...dem was BRUTAL when we first reach ya dred, never mind how dem did treat Africans, Haitians, etc. When people reach here and you despise them, what effect do you HONESTLY expect when they end up doing better than you?
With the change in the Immigration Act in the late 60's there was the large or beginning of the large influx of West Indians to Canada.
Ironically, it was met with resistance by black Canadians because they saw all these other blacks as being so culturally different to them. Skin color doesn't imply automatic unity. It took awhile before the concept of force in numbers to even begin to emerge. But until then the rule of thumb was black Canadians kept to themselves. They may not have been openingly hostile, but they made it clear, we werent one of them. So attitudes and biased belief patterns don't happen in a vacuum.
 

Mrs. Campbell

Girl Crush
With the change in the Immigration Act in the late 60's there was the large or beginning of the large influx of West Indians to Canada.
Ironically, it was met with resistance by black Canadians because they saw all these other blacks as being so culturally different to them. Skin color doesn't imply automatic unity. It took awhile before the concept of force in numbers to even begin to emerge. But until then the rule of thumb was black Canadians kept to themselves. They may not have been openingly hostile, but they made it clear, we werent one of them. So attitudes and biased belief patterns don't happen in a vacuum.
Could the mentality stem from: We're fighting for a small piece of pie, and here comes another group that could potentially want in and or take away from us.

Not saying it's right, but that could be the mental state. This also may apply to the American blacks view of Caribbean and Africans.
 

Lucianite

Registered User
Could the mentality stem from: We're fighting for a small piece of pie, and here comes another group that could potentially want in and or take away from us.

Not saying it's right, but that could be the mental state. This also may apply to the American blacks view of Caribbean and Africans.

Added to that a lack of history that would have tell them that we the same people who landed in different salve ports

And

They adopt a superior attitude that they are from a first world and we a third world and different

And we come with an attitude of feeling superior that we think they had not used the advantages we thnk they have had .....
 

LB

Peace Love n Pretty Tings
Could the mentality stem from: We're fighting for a small piece of pie, and here comes another group that could potentially want in and or take away from us.

Not saying it's right, but that could be the mental state. This also may apply to the American blacks view of Caribbean and Africans.
My guess that plays a big part in it. It's not right like you mentioned but it is human nature to feel threatened. Perceived struggle for resources is real. Many of the West Indians who came at the onset were economic migrants (as opposed to family reunification immigration) So they came with specific skill sets that were needed due to labour shortages in certain provinces.

I remember a story my Dad told when he first moved here before me and mum. He ran across the street, almost getting himself run over because to him thank God he finally saw another black person like himself. :kicks He wanted to greet him and say hello to this other black man - the man was a black Canadian, who was startled/annoyed/indignant that this fresh off the banana boat man thought they were kin. My dad wasn't upset about it just taken aback at first because it was a new thing for him. And then he just laughed it off.

But black Canadians here lived amongst themselves and didnt start integrating until I'd say the last 2 generations.

Most of my black Canadian friends were first generation city dwellers, (ancestors were mainly farmers) and like many Africans, didnt call themselves black or saw me and them as the same kind of "black". But this never made me look down on them or discount their experience. It just was. So I dont owe or not owe anything to black Canadians.

But what paved the way for Caribbean folks to migrate here was the Immigration Act change. Not necessarily do to any lobbying on the part of blacks already here. They didnt have that kind of political power to begin with.
 

TTCLIFEMEMBER

everyday working man
My guess that plays a big part in it. It's not right like you mentioned but it is human nature to feel threatened. Perceived struggle for resources is real. Many of the West Indians who came at the onset were economic migrants (as opposed to family reunification immigration) So they came with specific skill sets that were needed due to labour shortages in certain provinces.

I remember a story my Dad told when he first moved here before me and mum. He ran across the street, almost getting himself run over because to him thank God he finally saw another black person like himself. :kicks He wanted to greet him and say hello to this other black man - the man was a black Canadian, who was startled/annoyed/indignant that this fresh off the banana boat man thought they were kin. My dad wasn't upset about it just taken aback at first because it was a new thing for him. And then he just laughed it off.

But black Canadians here lived amongst themselves and didnt start integrating until I'd say the last 2 generations.

Most of my black Canadian friends were first generation city dwellers, (ancestors were mainly farmers) and like many Africans, didnt call themselves black or saw me and them as the same kind of "black". But this never made me look down on them or discount their experience. It just was. So I dont owe or not owe anything to black Canadians.

But what paved the way for Caribbean folks to migrate here was the Immigration Act change. Not necessarily do to any lobbying on the part of blacks already here. They didnt have that kind of political power to begin with.

Which province do you live in ? I ask, not because I don`t believe what you`re saying but because my experience with black Canadians was kind of different. I met black Scotians in Toronto who saw me as black just like them but they recognized that I have a different heritage. This never caused any friction between us though. Never heard my parents talk about black Canadians treating them badly. But you`re right that black Canadians lived amongst themselves for a long time so it would not surprise me if there were cases of black Canadians being anti-black Caribbean.

I agree that the Immigration Act was what allowed our families to immigrate here. Canada was and still is very underpopulated so they need immigrants. At the same time, when I studied black Canadian history and saw the things that black Canadians did in this country, I think that there is a level of respect that is owed to them and they owe it to us.
 

LB

Peace Love n Pretty Tings
Which province do you live in ? I ask, not because I don`t believe what you`re saying but because my experience with black Canadians was kind of different. I met black Scotians in Toronto who saw me as black just like them but they recognized that I have a different heritage. This never caused any friction between us though. Never heard my parents talk about black Canadians treating them badly. But you`re right that black Canadians lived amongst themselves for a long time so it would not surprise me if there were cases of black Canadians being anti-black Caribbean.

I agree that the Immigration Act was what allowed our families to immigrate here. Canada was and still is very underpopulated so they need immigrants. At the same time, when I studied black Canadian history and saw the things that black Canadians did in this country, I think that there is a level of respect that is owed to them and they owe it to us.
I live out west. As I said it wasn't like it was some big deal. They lived amongst themselves and an outside was an outsider. Only until they started moving into cities and having to integrate that there was some relaxation. The point I made was that sense of unity solely based on skin colour wasn't there. So the expectation my dad had as a black person that their would be a sense of "kinship" in a city predominantly white, wasn't a need or expectation on their part. And you have to take into account the time period I'm talking about.
I just have not experienced West Indians even regardless of the generation, speaking about black Canadians as a rule to look down on them or discount what they may or May not have contributed. It was just a non-issue which is far different from what you have expressed.
 

jamaicangirl

Boonoonoonoos
why u packin so much heat against me?

yall act like if Black Americans are the only one to be prejudice against other groups

black people from the north prejudice against people from the south

black americans prejudice against black caribbean

africans prejuidce against black caribbean

jamaicans prejudice against trinis

nigerians prejudice against ghanians

dominicans prejudice against ricans

and so on and so on and vice versa and all kind of thing, its human nature to build boundaries, demarcations and play on differences.
Jamaicans don't even think about Trinis. I am never in a group of Jamaicans and we start talking about any of the other islands unless there is a specific person who happens to be from somewhere else- and not even then do we focus on the island, we more focus on the person or the incident. Other islands are not on our radar at all.
 

jamaicangirl

Boonoonoonoos
A similar if not deeper tension exists between Britons of Caribbean and African origin. For a long time, 'Caribbeanness' was treated by the white British popular culture as being cool, while 'Africanness' was seen as anything-but-cool. It came down to stereotyped images of rastafari, reggae and relaxation on one side and war, poverty and famine on the other.

That may be changing, as a younger generation of Africans assimilate more, but it definitely drove a wedge among the two communities.
Interesting. Can you tell us a little more about this.
 
Jamaicans don't even think about Trinis. I am never in a group of Jamaicans and we start talking about any of the other islands unless there is a specific person who happens to be from somewhere else- and not even then do we focus on the island, we more focus on the person or the incident. Other islands are not on our radar at all.
why are you so illiterate? do you hear african americans talking about caribbean people all the time?

do you understand what prejudice means?

ok mother of Jamaica, knoweth all and seeith all
 

jamaicangirl

Boonoonoonoos
why are you so illiterate? do you hear african americans talking about caribbean people all the time?

do you understand what prejudice means?
Use a dictionary then read the statement. Then write something that makes sense.

Jamaicans do not think about Trinis. That means we are not prejudiced. FOR EXAMPLE, whites talk about Blacks all the time because they are prejudiced and we are always on their minds. Trinis sit around talking about Jamaicans all the time (I know because I have been in their company when this happens and they did not know I was Jamaican. One girl told me that I dance "like a Trini" so she thought I was from there or that my parent were from there. Not once or twice but several times I have been around other Caribbean people and Jamaicans come up. THAT is prejudice.

It isn't that complicated. Use a dictionary. Take your time.
 
Use a dictionary then read the statement. Then write something that makes sense.

Jamaicans do not think about Trinis. That means we are not prejudiced. FOR EXAMPLE, whites talk about Blacks all the time because they are prejudiced and we are always on their minds. Trinis sit around talking about Jamaicans all the time (I know because I have been in their company when this happens and they did not know I was Jamaican. One girl told me that I dance "like a Trini" so she thought I was from there or that my parent were from there. Not once or twice but several times I have been around other Caribbean people and Jamaicans come up. THAT is prejudice.

It isn't that complicated. Use a dictionary. Take your time.
hmm you are dumb...goodbye

i drew an example of tensions or problems among groups but u quick to come talk nonsense....u really think african americans or caribbean people in brooklyn talk about each other all the time? No but they usually are prejudice to each other at sometime

everytime someone mentions jamaicans allyuh always say jamaicans dont care or talk about nobody, alyuh exist on an island and know nothing else right?

i know for a fact that MANY jamaicans are prejudiced towards africans, Haitians, other caribbean people and African Americans, it dont mean that you spend every living minute talking about it....GET YOUR LIFE
 
Use a dictionary then read the statement. Then write something that makes sense.

Jamaicans do not think about Trinis. That means we are not prejudiced. FOR EXAMPLE, whites talk about Blacks all the time because they are prejudiced and we are always on their minds. Trinis sit around talking about Jamaicans all the time (I know because I have been in their company when this happens and they did not know I was Jamaican. One girl told me that I dance "like a Trini" so she thought I was from there or that my parent were from there. Not once or twice but several times I have been around other Caribbean people and Jamaicans come up. THAT is prejudice.

It isn't that complicated. Use a dictionary. Take your time.
I grew up in trinidad so i can talk, most trinis talk about the dancehall/reggae scene or the trini men in trinidad i know would mention that most jamaican women are ugly but other than that you would swear alyuh get talked about everyday

now take a trip to jamaica gleaner or observer and see how alyuh badmind everyone, alyuh applaud when Barbados economy going down

alyuh sick
 

Missmayling

Registered User
Absolutely just like the black Americans owe Caribbean people something and that is mutual respect.

For black people down there to talk about the opportunities they have in the U.S. without respecting the struggles of black Americans and black Caribbeans is crazy.

This mentality where we people say ¨well, my people were part of the struggle so I don`t owe you any respect or common decency¨ is backwards to me. For me to treat someone as less, it has to be because of that person`s behaviour and the mentality that makes them think that this behaviour is acceptable. Not just because of where they are from.
Stop trying to being so PC. There isn't that big of a rift between the two group as far as WI and AA and it's more of a class issue. WI and Southerners tend to get along and that's usually who you see WI socializing with an marrying. The real division is about clannish attitude when it comes to dating or marriage as the AA see the immigrants as having money or having ambition. The illegals see this as a way to get their green cards as both sides are trying to use the other. When I hear a WI or an AA talking crap about the other group, it's usually from a recent breakup.
 

robblaten

New member
All the arguments on this thread dance around and avoid the most obvious of facts: the USA is hell for everyone deemed 'black', whether African American or immigrant. Why the hell a person of colour would choose of their own accord to live there is a mystery within itself - especially when they have the right to live in their own independent, prosperous, comparatively developed Caribbean countries. The USA is going nowhere fast, while the Caribbean region has nothing but excitement in its future. African Americans at least have the excuse of knowing no better and being ignorant enough (like their white counterparts) to believe the country's self sustaining myths.
 
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