How much does IMIXers know West Indians in Latin America?

Otorongo

Salsero de pura cepa
no they werent. Indio panamanians (really just columbians) were the majority, afro panamanians were only the majority in places like Portobello. The influx of west indians to the country is the main reason blacks are all over the place in panama today.
Who said anything about Blacks? I said Afro-Panameños. Afrodescendientes. And Colombia has had over 25 % of its population of Afrodescent. And the area of Panama even more than that. Most people still have Recent African ancestry. Mulatos or Mestizos, they still are Afropanameños by majority. Now will they admit to that? That is a different question.

And have you ever been to panama??
Yes I have. Gracias por todas las panameñas lindas.

The peinas (black panamanians) are deep black they look very african, and speak no english.
Yes, but they are not the majority that I was speaking of (Nor are they deep black, just deep brown :grin: ). Los cimmarrones todavía existen.

AfroMestizos of Panama

También lee
LA PRESENCIA DEL NEGRO EN EL PANAMÁ COLONIAL
 
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jamaicangirl

Boonoonoonoos
I'm getting alot of red xs. What are in the pictures?

Its funny that I first learned that there were blacks in Costa Rica from a White Costa Rican. We were chatting and when he realized that I was Jamaican he told me there were lots of Jamaicans back home. I was like "HUH?" but then I looked it up and found out what he meant.

Please let us know the source for the population estimates and what they are considering "black"?

Excellent thread.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
I know most Panamanian have bajan, Lucian, yardie background. During slavery time French, British would trade slaves from their colonies to the Spain colonies for money, I’m not too sure about other Spanish speaking country. But I know most
Panamanian have west-Indian background for sure .. the blacks in Panama build the canal
That's not true. Most Panamanians are actually mixed. And Panama had very large amounts and large numbers of black African slaves.

Those Panamanians that you find in the states tend to be descendants of West Indians that came to Panama. They are very different from Hispanic Spanish speaking Black Panamanians.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
Nonsense...each country carried on their own slave trade, there was no trading of slaves among European powers. Afro-Panamanians today are largely descended from the migrant workers from the West Indies who went there as you said to work on the building of the Canal.
Where did you get this nonsensical information you just posted? There were African slaves in EVERY nation in the western hemisphere including in what is now the Republic of Panama. Many of the slaves that were brought to South America had to pass through Panama. Panama was a very strategic area for slave trade as well as for African slaves.

The majority of Afro Panamanians in Panama are from old school colonial/slave stock. In other words those descended from the large population of blacks brought to Panama during the colonial period as a result of the slave trade. Traditional original Spanish speaking Hispanic black Panamanians are different from the West Indians that came to Panama.

Much of the West Indians and their descendants have left Panama for the USA to become U.S. citizens.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
Bullshit. Afro-Panamanians have been the majority of the population since way before the West Indian population arrived. The difference is that the majority are of stronger tri-ethnic descent and much higher mix than the incoming West Indians.
That depends on what you consider or classify as diqué (so called) "Afro Panamanian"? There still many more larger populations of dark(er) skinned blacks of Afro-colonial descent in Panama in many places that probably have little to no admixtures. Also West Indians are mixed as well too in varying degrees.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
no they werent. Indio panamanians (really just columbians) were the majority, afro panamanians were only the majority in places like Portobello. The influx of west indians to the country is the main reason blacks are all over the place in panama today.

And have you ever been to panama??

The peinas (black panamanians) are deep black they look very african, and speak no english.
What do you mean by "Indio Panamanians? What is "peinas"?

And what do you mean by "really just Colombians"? What exactly defines this context of being Colombian, because ties with Colombia were fully severed in 1921 and 1922 upon the then pending independence revolt dispute in which the U.S. stole the Department of Panama from Colombia.

And nope, sorry to burst your bubble sir but Panama has always been diverse and at the same time racially mixed.

Also you are sadly mistaken if you think that the influx of West Indians (who were not all black) are the main reason for blacks being all over Panama today.

West Indians are known for often clustering together given their situation and circumstances. West Indians settled in a few neighborhoods in Panama City, and in the City of Colón, and in some parts of Bocas del Toro and there were even some in Chiriqui.

The original Spanish speaking Hispanic colonial black Panamanians on the other hand have always been known for being widespread throughout Panama as they were mostly from rural backgrounds and then you had those migrating to the urban cities joining urban colonial blacks that have always been there. The presence of colonial blacks can be detected and found in virtually every province of Panama. Panama province, most of Colón Province (Costa Arriba, Costa Abajo, and some parts of Colon City), and Darien province have a lot of colonial blacks. In addition the colonial blacks cultures are diverse and not homogenous. In the Pearl Islands, they are inhabited entirely by descendants of colonial African slaves. In the province of Coclé, (especially in Río Hato) one can find colonial blacks there, and even in Veraguas and parts of Azuero Peninsula as well.

Panama City has colonial blacks also. Pacora is the oldest corregimiento in Panama (PTY) founded in 1582 as a free palenque and it's people, culture, food, history, legacy, Anf descendants stil live and remain there today. It was the first recognized cimarron settlement in the Western Hemisphere recognized in agreement by the royal Spanish crown in 1582.

The area and strip of land where the Panama Canal was built were a series of colonial black towns and settlements for cimarrones and emancipated slaves from the colonial era. Many were displaced from the building of the Panama Canal. So many spread out even more throughout Panama since then.

Also if you check census records and the most recent census under Afrodescendant tabulation category "Afro-colonial" was the majority marked designation for those identifying as Afrodescendant. Also many often wrongly equate "black" in Panama with meaning "Antillano", to the point where ppl falsely equate colonial blacks as "antillano" when most blacks in Panama are of colonial black stock. Colonial blacks outnumber West Indian descent blacks 2 to 1, although judging from further research it may be that Afro Colonials/negros nativos outnumber the antillanos 3 to 1.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
Actually, there are still Guatemalan blacks descended from the early colonial times. They still live in Guatemala today. Spanish speaking Colonial blacks in Guatemala never disappeared. They still exist
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
A lot of people from the Caribbean and West Indian islands and regions settled in Brazil for work in the 19th century and throughout the 20th century and the descendants of these peoples can be found in many areas of Brazil.
 

ObscureOpulence

Registered User
Very wrong. Many West Indians have left Panama over the years. Most Afro-Panamanians in Panama are descendants of African slaves and Spanish speaking African settlers that arrived to Panama during the Spanish colonial period. Africans have been living in Panama since the year 1500.

When West Indians passed through or went to Panama they encountered large populations of blacks that had already been living there. Most black Panamanians are Roman Catholic and monolingual Spanish speakers.

The largest immigrant group that lives in Panama are COLOMBIANS.

West Indian descent Panamanians in Panama are like a dying breed or their culture of distinct identity is fading faster and faster, and many are integrated. It's mostly the older generations of Panamanians of West Indian descent that retain West Indian cultural elements and values. In addition, many WI descent Panamanians have migrated to the USA or to other places abroad, so it's decreased their presence on the isthmus.
 

robblaten

New member
Very wrong. Many West Indians have left Panama over the years. Most Afro-Panamanians in Panama are descendants of African slaves and Spanish speaking African settlers that arrived to Panama during the Spanish colonial period. Africans have been living in Panama since the year 1500.

When West Indians passed through or went to Panama they encountered large populations of blacks that had already been living there. Most black Panamanians are Roman Catholic and monolingual Spanish speakers.

The largest immigrant group that lives in Panama are COLOMBIANS.

West Indian descent Panamanians in Panama are like a dying breed or their culture of distinct identity is fading faster and faster, and many are integrated. It's mostly the older generations of Panamanians of West Indian descent that retain West Indian cultural elements and values. In addition, many WI descent Panamanians have migrated to the USA or to other places abroad, so it's decreased their presence on the isthmus.
Having been to Panama and Costa Rica, what I fail to understand is why every single person there of WI heritage does not get on a plane and head back home, cursing their ancestors for having made such a dumb move.........then again, I feel the same way about people living in the USA of WI origin!
 
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